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	<title>Comments on: How Cumulative Breadth Can Mislead You</title>
	<link>http://www.tradersnarrative.com/how-cumulative-breadth-can-mislead-you-974.html</link>
	<description>Freshly squeezed market commentary &#038; analysis</description>
	<pubDate>Sat, 05 Jul 2008 18:43:24 +0000</pubDate>
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		<title>by: Market Breadth Doesn&#8217;t Matter, Until It Does</title>
		<link>http://www.tradersnarrative.com/how-cumulative-breadth-can-mislead-you-974.html#comment-33005</link>
		<pubDate>Thu, 08 May 2008 02:38:58 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid>http://www.tradersnarrative.com/how-cumulative-breadth-can-mislead-you-974.html#comment-33005</guid>
					<description>[...] Every once in a while the bears point to the &amp;#8220;negative divergence&amp;#8221; in the Nasdaq index and the Nasdaq cumulative breadth. They get worked up over the fact that market breadth does not correspond to the market price. Here is the recent Nasdaq breadth, showing a waterfall decline, in contrast to the Nasdaq Composite index: [...]</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>[&#8230;] Every once in a while the bears point to the &#8220;negative divergence&#8221; in the Nasdaq index and the Nasdaq cumulative breadth. They get worked up over the fact that market breadth does not correspond to the market price. Here is the recent Nasdaq breadth, showing a waterfall decline, in contrast to the Nasdaq Composite index: [&#8230;]
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		<title>by: NYSE Advance Decline Numbers Can Mislead You</title>
		<link>http://www.tradersnarrative.com/how-cumulative-breadth-can-mislead-you-974.html#comment-7595</link>
		<pubDate>Wed, 06 Jun 2007 23:45:45 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid>http://www.tradersnarrative.com/how-cumulative-breadth-can-mislead-you-974.html#comment-7595</guid>
					<description>[...] I&amp;#8217;ve mentioned several times that I prefer to look at Nasdaq numbers when it comes to breadth (in a non-cumulative way) because NYSE breadth numbers are &amp;#8220;polluted&amp;#8221; with non-common stock securities. [...]</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>[&#8230;] I&#8217;ve mentioned several times that I prefer to look at Nasdaq numbers when it comes to breadth (in a non-cumulative way) because NYSE breadth numbers are &#8220;polluted&#8221; with non-common stock securities. [&#8230;]
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		<title>by: &#160; Blog Carnival &#124; Raking in profits from stock trading @ StockRake.com&#160;by&#160;Stock Rake</title>
		<link>http://www.tradersnarrative.com/how-cumulative-breadth-can-mislead-you-974.html#comment-7458</link>
		<pubDate>Mon, 04 Jun 2007 04:06:29 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid>http://www.tradersnarrative.com/how-cumulative-breadth-can-mislead-you-974.html#comment-7458</guid>
					<description>[...] How Cumulative Breadth Can Mislead You posted at Trader&amp;#8217;s Narrative One great indicator is the advance decline number which shows you, on any given day, how many stocks closed up and how many closed down. [...]</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>[&#8230;] How Cumulative Breadth Can Mislead You posted at Trader&#8217;s Narrative One great indicator is the advance decline number which shows you, on any given day, how many stocks closed up and how many closed down. [&#8230;]
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		<title>by: Babak</title>
		<link>http://www.tradersnarrative.com/how-cumulative-breadth-can-mislead-you-974.html#comment-7328</link>
		<pubDate>Thu, 31 May 2007 21:12:13 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid>http://www.tradersnarrative.com/how-cumulative-breadth-can-mislead-you-974.html#comment-7328</guid>
					<description>dk,
you're welcome. If you do find anything, let me know!

as for the NYSE breadth, that's a whole 'nother animal. For the past dozen or so years the NYSE has been infiltrated with non-common stock securities. Bonds (like the GM ones), munis, CEFs, and other weird and woolly animals that bear no resemblance to honest to goodness equities.

The result is that it has totally messed up the breadth numbers. Smart people (like Lowry's) have worked very hard to keep a pruned list of only common stock breadth. But this sort of info is not readily available for free.

I suspect that the two breadth numbers look nothing alike.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>dk,<br />
you&#8217;re welcome. If you do find anything, let me know!</p>
<p>as for the NYSE breadth, that&#8217;s a whole &#8216;nother animal. For the past dozen or so years the NYSE has been infiltrated with non-common stock securities. Bonds (like the GM ones), munis, CEFs, and other weird and woolly animals that bear no resemblance to honest to goodness equities.</p>
<p>The result is that it has totally messed up the breadth numbers. Smart people (like Lowry&#8217;s) have worked very hard to keep a pruned list of only common stock breadth. But this sort of info is not readily available for free.</p>
<p>I suspect that the two breadth numbers look nothing alike.
</p>
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		<title>by: dk</title>
		<link>http://www.tradersnarrative.com/how-cumulative-breadth-can-mislead-you-974.html#comment-7318</link>
		<pubDate>Thu, 31 May 2007 13:10:26 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid>http://www.tradersnarrative.com/how-cumulative-breadth-can-mislead-you-974.html#comment-7318</guid>
					<description>Hi Babak...Thanks so much for the explanation.  I wish I could find more data on Meisler's &quot;weak IPO&quot; theory for NASDAQ cumulative breadth underperformance.  Cumulative breadth on the NYSE is starkly different, i.e. very positive.  Your original post was a timely one, as I've noticed more and more recent chatter about breadth divergence.  Thanks again...good stuff around here....dk</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Hi Babak&#8230;Thanks so much for the explanation.  I wish I could find more data on Meisler&#8217;s &#8220;weak IPO&#8221; theory for NASDAQ cumulative breadth underperformance.  Cumulative breadth on the NYSE is starkly different, i.e. very positive.  Your original post was a timely one, as I&#8217;ve noticed more and more recent chatter about breadth divergence.  Thanks again&#8230;good stuff around here&#8230;.dk
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		<title>by: Babak</title>
		<link>http://www.tradersnarrative.com/how-cumulative-breadth-can-mislead-you-974.html#comment-7187</link>
		<pubDate>Mon, 28 May 2007 21:28:21 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid>http://www.tradersnarrative.com/how-cumulative-breadth-can-mislead-you-974.html#comment-7187</guid>
					<description>dk,
thanks. re the why, I hesitated to write about it because it doesn't seem to follow logic. If I remember correctly, Helene told me that this was something she had observed &quot;forever&quot; and it was caused by the myriad new issues that come to market but &quot;do nothing&quot;, meaning that they go down, then flop around in very low ranges. This skews the data and produces the &quot;ski hill&quot; phenomena.

Does that makes sense? logically no. Because you would expect such &quot;loser&quot; stocks to have a neutral effect as they flop positive one day, then negative the next. But the fact that they perpetually go down, may have something to do with it.

The NASI is built on the same inputs so I'm not surprised it shows you similar characteristics. Hope that helps, 
Cheers</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>dk,<br />
thanks. re the why, I hesitated to write about it because it doesn&#8217;t seem to follow logic. If I remember correctly, Helene told me that this was something she had observed &#8220;forever&#8221; and it was caused by the myriad new issues that come to market but &#8220;do nothing&#8221;, meaning that they go down, then flop around in very low ranges. This skews the data and produces the &#8220;ski hill&#8221; phenomena.</p>
<p>Does that makes sense? logically no. Because you would expect such &#8220;loser&#8221; stocks to have a neutral effect as they flop positive one day, then negative the next. But the fact that they perpetually go down, may have something to do with it.</p>
<p>The NASI is built on the same inputs so I&#8217;m not surprised it shows you similar characteristics. Hope that helps,<br />
Cheers
</p>
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		<title>by: dk</title>
		<link>http://www.tradersnarrative.com/how-cumulative-breadth-can-mislead-you-974.html#comment-7176</link>
		<pubDate>Mon, 28 May 2007 15:01:20 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid>http://www.tradersnarrative.com/how-cumulative-breadth-can-mislead-you-974.html#comment-7176</guid>
					<description>Interesting post.  Your cumulative breadth observations are dead on, and it's a pattern I've observed and charted for some time.  Incidentally, the McClellan's NASI is another breadth indicator that shows this divergence with NASDAQ price.  In fact, NASI contour bears a striking resemblence cumulative A/D.

The only problem is that you neglected to cite the &quot;very good reason&quot; Meisler helped you identify for the cumulative price/breadth divergence!  My own work led me to smooth $NAAD with EMA 5 and 20, and I'd love to understand the underlying logic of why this works so much more reliably than cuimulative metrics.  Thanks....dk</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Interesting post.  Your cumulative breadth observations are dead on, and it&#8217;s a pattern I&#8217;ve observed and charted for some time.  Incidentally, the McClellan&#8217;s NASI is another breadth indicator that shows this divergence with NASDAQ price.  In fact, NASI contour bears a striking resemblence cumulative A/D.</p>
<p>The only problem is that you neglected to cite the &#8220;very good reason&#8221; Meisler helped you identify for the cumulative price/breadth divergence!  My own work led me to smooth $NAAD with EMA 5 and 20, and I&#8217;d love to understand the underlying logic of why this works so much more reliably than cuimulative metrics.  Thanks&#8230;.dk
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		<title>by: Investment Jungle &#187; Blog Archive &#187; Festival of Stocks #38</title>
		<link>http://www.tradersnarrative.com/how-cumulative-breadth-can-mislead-you-974.html#comment-7151</link>
		<pubDate>Mon, 28 May 2007 04:03:02 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid>http://www.tradersnarrative.com/how-cumulative-breadth-can-mislead-you-974.html#comment-7151</guid>
					<description>[...] How Cumulative Breadth Can Mislead You posted at Trader&amp;#8217;s Narrative [...]</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>[&#8230;] How Cumulative Breadth Can Mislead You posted at Trader&#8217;s Narrative [&#8230;]
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		<title>by: Babak</title>
		<link>http://www.tradersnarrative.com/how-cumulative-breadth-can-mislead-you-974.html#comment-7118</link>
		<pubDate>Sun, 27 May 2007 03:07:44 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid>http://www.tradersnarrative.com/how-cumulative-breadth-can-mislead-you-974.html#comment-7118</guid>
					<description>Michael,

Thanks for dropping by and commenting.

I didn't accuse you of misleading readers - I was pointing out that you are very biased.  And, how do you know that I haven't read your book?  In any case, I'd prefer to talk about the topic and not get personal.

The point is that if we look at a long term graph of the Nasdaq cumulative adv-dec it is easy to see the fallacy of trying to wring any sort of significance from it for the market as it has been in perpetual decline.

Perhaps you would care to take a look at such a chart and then perhaps reconsider your current bearish position.

cheers</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Michael,</p>
<p>Thanks for dropping by and commenting.</p>
<p>I didn&#8217;t accuse you of misleading readers - I was pointing out that you are very biased.  And, how do you know that I haven&#8217;t read your book?  In any case, I&#8217;d prefer to talk about the topic and not get personal.</p>
<p>The point is that if we look at a long term graph of the Nasdaq cumulative adv-dec it is easy to see the fallacy of trying to wring any sort of significance from it for the market as it has been in perpetual decline.</p>
<p>Perhaps you would care to take a look at such a chart and then perhaps reconsider your current bearish position.</p>
<p>cheers
</p>
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		<title>by: Michael Panzner</title>
		<link>http://www.tradersnarrative.com/how-cumulative-breadth-can-mislead-you-974.html#comment-7111</link>
		<pubDate>Sat, 26 May 2007 22:45:30 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid>http://www.tradersnarrative.com/how-cumulative-breadth-can-mislead-you-974.html#comment-7111</guid>
					<description>It is ironic that you accused me of misleading readers. You quote me out of context and distort my worlds to achieve the same aim.

Here's what I wrote: &quot;While not necessarily a sign of trouble ahead, this sort of divergence often signals that a market lacks the broad participation necessary for a sustainable advance.&quot; I also wrote &quot;Like other recent indicators, it also suggests that the bulls need to tread carefully in the current environment, at least with respect to technology shares.&quot; For some reason, you left off the first part of both sentences. Hmm, I wonder why? Trying to make a point about how clever you are, perhaps?

In addition, you forgot to mention that I am the author of two books, Financial Armageddon: Protecting Your Future from Four Impending Catastrophes and The New Laws of the Stock Market Jungle: An Insider's Guide to Successful Investing in a Changing World (which was not bearish, in case you were wondering). Your inclusion of only one title gives the impression that my view is solely driven by my latest book.

You also make reference to my &quot;bombastic&quot; predictions without actually having read the book to see why I feel the way I do, which speaks volumes about your approach to analysis. I at least have a logical basis for my argument.

If you read all of my posts at bloggingstocks.com, you will find that they cover a lot of ground. My second to last post was &quot;Rising 'Spider' turnover -- what does it mean?&quot; [http://www.bloggingstocks.com/2007/05/23/rising-spider-turnover-what-does-it-mean/], which discusses the relative increase in volume of the S&amp;#38;P 500 ETFs to that of the overall market.

Finally, there are more than two years worth of graphs at the site of my first book, some of which are bearish and some of which are bullish. [http://www.stockmarketjungle.com/usefullinks.htm]

Yes, I am very bearish right now, for fundamental as well as technical reasons. This is a very dangerous market envirnoment, and those who lack experience in all kinds of markets and under a variety of trading conditions can't really appreciate that. 

I guess to some so-called trading &quot;experts,&quot; ignorance is bliss.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>It is ironic that you accused me of misleading readers. You quote me out of context and distort my worlds to achieve the same aim.</p>
<p>Here&#8217;s what I wrote: &#8220;While not necessarily a sign of trouble ahead, this sort of divergence often signals that a market lacks the broad participation necessary for a sustainable advance.&#8221; I also wrote &#8220;Like other recent indicators, it also suggests that the bulls need to tread carefully in the current environment, at least with respect to technology shares.&#8221; For some reason, you left off the first part of both sentences. Hmm, I wonder why? Trying to make a point about how clever you are, perhaps?</p>
<p>In addition, you forgot to mention that I am the author of two books, Financial Armageddon: Protecting Your Future from Four Impending Catastrophes and The New Laws of the Stock Market Jungle: An Insider&#8217;s Guide to Successful Investing in a Changing World (which was not bearish, in case you were wondering). Your inclusion of only one title gives the impression that my view is solely driven by my latest book.</p>
<p>You also make reference to my &#8220;bombastic&#8221; predictions without actually having read the book to see why I feel the way I do, which speaks volumes about your approach to analysis. I at least have a logical basis for my argument.</p>
<p>If you read all of my posts at bloggingstocks.com, you will find that they cover a lot of ground. My second to last post was &#8220;Rising &#8216;Spider&#8217; turnover &#8212; what does it mean?&#8221; [http://www.bloggingstocks.com/2007/05/23/rising-spider-turnover-what-does-it-mean/], which discusses the relative increase in volume of the S&amp;P 500 ETFs to that of the overall market.</p>
<p>Finally, there are more than two years worth of graphs at the site of my first book, some of which are bearish and some of which are bullish. [http://www.stockmarketjungle.com/usefullinks.htm]</p>
<p>Yes, I am very bearish right now, for fundamental as well as technical reasons. This is a very dangerous market envirnoment, and those who lack experience in all kinds of markets and under a variety of trading conditions can&#8217;t really appreciate that. </p>
<p>I guess to some so-called trading &#8220;experts,&#8221; ignorance is bliss.
</p>
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